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Thread: Chowdren - Blazingly fast Fusion ports for desktop, consoles and mobile

  1. #21
    Phi, you need to understand that Chowdren is not an elaborate new runtime, it's rather a framework for porting your MMF games to C++ (and OS X, Linux, FreeBSD, anything that can create OpenGL contexts really). I've already put in the work to make Nifflas' games work, but chances are you will have to do some work yourself if your extensions aren't supported yet. In that case, feel free to send me patches and code - I'd be happy to merge anything on GitHub.

    In other news, binaries are coming up today.

    EDIT: Binaries are up. See first post.
    Last edited by Mathias; 2nd December 2012 at 01:42 PM.
    MP2 Games - Site

  2. #22
    I disagree Nifflas, porting is not the same as upgrading, you have to take the good with the bad, and be consistent.
    Thing about MMF2 is that there are tons of extensions and we aren't expecting all that to work, right? Why do then the built-in features need to be treated differently, that is, the ones that doesn't make sense? MMF2 including all its addons is a product that is way too hard for one person to port, so things needs to be left out. I think the super limited one-trick ponies are the best candidates (even if they're built-ins), it doesn't take a lot of work to simply replace them with a better object.

    When it comes to Knytt Underground, I've done plenty of changes from my side too so that Mathias would have to port less features. I didn't simply expect every single one I wanted to run. In case of Chowdren, right now your options are to make your game for the limited set of features that Chowdren has (and it does have the important stuff), or add support for more extensions and features yourself (which would be great, please submit those to Mathias since it improves Chowdren).

  3. #23
    I hope someone fleshes this out into something the majority could actually use. Otherwise it's really just a tease. It's like "hey guys, here's this awesome exporter but you'll have to finish coding it yourself if you want it to work with your game..." on a forum for a community where the majority of people are here because they aren't C++ programmers in the first place. :/

    I don't mean to sound ungrateful or anything, but most of us don't have the ability to do anything with this code... but it's nice that you released it for anyone that might, I guess.

  4. #24
    It depends on the game. Stick to the objects listed by me earlier, rely on actives to display text (via my active object text blitter example), avoid the built-in movements, score, lives, and the player objects. Avoid sub-apps and global objects. Make sure to never make an expression that refers to an object that may not exist (it crashes Chowdren, but it's fixed by inserting a condition that checks for the object's existence). For custom keyboard controls, rely on Jamie's keyboard object.

    I mean, you do need to make your game around Chowdren's set of features and restrictions, but if you can do that your game will run much faster than on the MMF2 runtime and you'll have Windows/OS X/Linux support. It's worth the effort and it's not like Mathias just ported every single thing I needed without me doing anything (I've helped a lot with testing, and made plenty of modifications to the game to make the process easier). So, it's false that most of you don't have the ability to do something with Chowdren. You do if you put effort into it, just as I did. Mathias can help getting your specific game supported, but it's nice to give something for all this effort. In my case have a deal with Mathias that gives him a share of the game revenue.

  5. #25
    So active objects are okay? I feel like if we had a better idea of exactly what can be done, it wouldn't feel so overwhelming. I always try to have my games use minimal extensions and use only the most basic and flexible ones, but being limited to a dozen might be difficult. Also the talk about not all conditions/actions for the objects not being supported makes it even more daunting.

    Wouldn't it be better if we all just donated some money to Mathias to build something more robust? I'd definitely chip in for something like this.

  6. #26
    Making a complete runtime with support of all of MMF2's bugs (yes, bugs) and quirks would take a long time. For Anaconda, it was a necessity, but for Chowdren, I wanted it to be fast and work properly for Nifflas' games. To be honest, Anaconda never gave a return on the effort I put into it, partly because of CT's ignorance and partly because people always needed some really exotic Windows-specific extension that I would have to implement. It's extremely hard to find all of MMF2's sketchy corners (there are many), so I'd rather work on the features that people actually need.

    I think you should look in the source code for Chowdren if you want to see what's supported.
    Native system events that are supported:
    Partially (or fully, look in the source) supported extensions:
    Supported native objects:

    Like Nifflas says, if you have a game and you want it ported to Windows/Mac/Linux(/some other interesting platform with OpenGL), feel free to contact me. I probably won't do things for free if your game needs a lot of extensions and features implemented, but it will largely depend on the game.
    MP2 Games - Site

  7. #27
    Mathias. Would you please expand on CT's ignorance, in this case?


    ​421 MMF2 & CTF 2.5 Examples and games

  8. #28
    Mathias, would you please post a mini post-mortem on Anaconda?

  9. #29

    congratulation!, i know anaconda have not received all the recognition you deserve and the hours you put on this, hopefully someday python will go easily in a single lib, and i know for sure that you have learn a lot with.

    Fernando Vivolo

    ... new things are coming ...

  10. #30
    Fimbul, Anaconda is feature-complete and it works well. Several games have been ported with it, and if you need it to do something new, you can always fork the code on GitHub. So no, it's not dead, and I don't consider it as such. My point was that I didn't have to implement all the superficial and largely unnecessary features that people don't tend to use, and I will be using that approach with Chowdren.

    nivram, I won't elaborate on my issues with CT, sorry, but I can say it involved waiting more than 6 months with nothing but a "I think we are working on it, maybe".
    MP2 Games - Site

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